Niro vs. Prius - Page 2 - Kia Niro Forum
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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-19-2018, 03:31 PM
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Not a must, but helpful for any car. It is just better. More expensive though, but I use a non paper filter and extend the change frequency. My car seems to be very tight, no noticeable oil loss. First car ever like that! Well, maybe my CRX, but I only had it one year. My Honda motorcycle is just as tight.

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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-19-2018, 04:41 PM
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I'd been driving the same 2005 model Prius from Nov 2004 through Nov 2017, at which point I traded it in for the Niro. I liked the CVT on the Prius -- it was smooth and responsive and never lacked for acceleration, in my experience. In comparison, the dual clutch transmission of the Niro is more choppy, with rough shifts and delayed engagement. This is the only unfavorable comparison to the Prius for me. Everything else about the Niro is an improvement over my 2005 Prius: the safety features and the interior finishes are quite an upgrade over the Prius. And most important, the Niro gets higher mpg, about 6 or 7 more mpg on average. I actually paid less for this Niro in 2017 than I did for the Prius back in 2004, yet the Niro is, in almost every way, clearly better.

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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-19-2018, 10:25 PM
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Delayed engagement after a full stop sure (common complaint), but it shouldn't be choppy. I've only experienced a few such shifts in 7,000 miles, and always when the car was cold and only the first few minutes and only on a downshift. Never thought it worth mentioning, my only concern was it didn't happen at all for the first 5,000 miles.

I've not seen anyone else describe the DCT as choppy, here or on the Ioniq forum. Might run it by your service department.

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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-19-2018, 10:34 PM Thread Starter
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I'd been driving the same 2005 model Prius from Nov 2004 through Nov 2017, at which point I traded it in for the Niro. I liked the CVT on the Prius -- it was smooth and responsive and never lacked for acceleration, in my experience. In comparison, the dual clutch transmission of the Niro is more choppy, with rough shifts and delayed engagement. This is the only unfavorable comparison to the Prius for me. Everything else about the Niro is an improvement over my 2005 Prius: the safety features and the interior finishes are quite an upgrade over the Prius. And most important, the Niro gets higher mpg, about 6 or 7 more mpg on average. I actually paid less for this Niro in 2017 than I did for the Prius back in 2004, yet the Niro is, in almost every way, clearly better.
I understand a lot of your comparisons having owned both the Gen 2 and Gen 3 Prius. I liked the CVT on the Prius also but I don't find the transmission on the Niro annoying and I haven't encountered the choppy shifts that your talking about. I hope this transmission stands the test of time. The Gen 2 Prius was pretty much indestructible. I agree the Niro gets better gas mileage than even the Gen 3 Prius, a nice SURPRISE. It's funny I never thought about it but your right the 2018 Niro cost me less than the Prius back in 2004.

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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-20-2018, 06:51 AM
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Hi Yticolev -- By "choppy" I meant the jerky lurch or surge that several of us (including me) have mentioned elsewhere on this website and which I've also seen mentioned in several online reviews of the Niro. Maybe "choppy" was not the best way to describe it. It's a sudden lurch at low speeds, but it doesn't happen every time I drive and is in fact quite rare -- it's happened maybe 10-15 times since I've been driving the car almost daily over the past 8 months. When it does happen, it is surprising and alarming for that brief moment, but it lasts just a second. The car never feels like it is out of my control because the "surge" is so brief, but I can easily imagine this causing a mild fender bender if the car is too close to an object in front.

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post #16 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-20-2018, 01:04 PM
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That surge is delayed engagement after a full stop? Yup, common. I thought you were attributing that to the DCT. In fact, it is the hydraulic clutch connecting the ICE to the rest of the drivetrain. As far as I know, the DCT (electrically activated, not hydraulic) spends 95% of the time fully engaged in a gear and is only in neutral between reverse and first. This is different from regular ICE only cars that have a DCT. There, the engagement between first and neutral is what gets the car going. The Niro attempts initial movement in EV and then brings in the ICE. Any clutch feathering is done by the hydraulic clutch but the car is already in gear.

It is this common delay that is upsetting for most when trying to cross or turn in traffic. Some compensate by putting the car in Sport mode for faster response to throttle, I compensate by starting my turn or cross a half second early. Any surge should be happening because you pressed the throttle farther that you would have if there had not been a delay. I can only imagine that this might happen in stop and go traffic where a surge could potentially cause a fender bender. A lighter foot will keep you in EV and be better for safety and mpg in such traffic. I've never experienced that sort of unwanted surge, perhaps because I keep egg shells under my throttle.

Not sure why the Hyundai/Kia engineers designed this delay. I assume that it is a feature (perhaps protecting some part of the power transmission, or efficiency), not a glitch. Because this car has done this from day one back in 2016. I read on the Ioniq forum that there was a mid 2017 software update that helped, but did not eliminate it.

In another note, Ioniq owners are getting an update now to improve braking. Tesla also did one recently after complaints from consumer reports about inconsistent 60-0 times. In my Niro, there is what appears to be a dangerous glitch in panic braking holding a bit longer than the pedal is depressed. I've never experienced that in another car. Disconcerting to do this in traffic and want to release when the car behind you appear unable to stop in time. Hopefully this update addresses that but that is an issue I haven't seen reported anywhere so it may not be addressed. Kind of amazing that a software update improves braking!

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post #17 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-20-2018, 02:35 PM
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Thanks for that info, yticolev. I'm not expert enough about cars to really know what the heck is going on! If I mistakenly attributed the surge to the DCT, I am happy to be corrected. I've actually learned some things reading these forums, and I'm grateful for it.



About the software update for braking, the Niro has one too, as others here have noted. When I took my car in for the hydraulic clutch actuator recall, they did this brake software update, but I don't have my car back yet so I do not know what difference the update made in the braking. I'll post about it next week (when I get the car back).

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post #18 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-20-2018, 07:33 PM
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I'm due for my first service. Definitely will be insisting on software update for my Dec 2017 manufactured date car. Probably schedule it for next week. Would you believe they have to order the specified 0W20 oil? I'm going to also insist on getting the used container to make sure the right stuff is added. The service rep I talked to says the oil is branded Kia!

I also have a list of things that vary from the manual. I don't expect to get satisfaction there, it is likely the variances are different trim levels or the PHEV. But the manual usually states that for other features only found on different trims - "if so equipped".

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post #19 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-21-2018, 08:07 AM
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I also have a list of things that vary from the manual. I don't expect to get satisfaction there, it is likely the variances are different trim levels or the PHEV. But the manual usually states that for other features only found on different trims - "if so equipped".
If you wish to share, people here may be able to help with some of those.
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post #20 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-21-2018, 10:54 AM
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If you wish to share, people here may be able to help with some of those.
I'll bite! I hate ACC, only want standard cruise control. The manual shows how to change it to standard and say the choice will stay sticky. It doesn't! I have to go through the change process every time I drive.

The manual shows an instant mpg number appearing above the bar graph. Doesn't in my car and I'd love to have it. But I believe the manual is showing a picture of a top level trim with a larger dash LCD.

So there are two things.

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