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Engine clutch actuator fluid
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There is a lot of D.Y.I's out there doing this service themselves. I just had the service done @ the dealership . Cost was 140. Had a good Conversation with the Top Mechanic doing this service. There is more to this service than just replacing the fluid. He printed out the complete service, which I will attach. He stated few niro owners are doing this service and agree'd that by not complying to what is dictated in the service manual. You are risking your warranty protection if problems arise. These dual clutch transmissions are highly technical and repair costs will be also. It's a no brainers decision for me to have this service done. Best of luck to those who chose otherwise.
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While I have no doubt the DCT is a complicated beast the engine clutch actuator has precisely nothing to do with it. The engine clutch sits between the ICE and the electric motor and is used to allow the ICE to run or not regardless of vehicle speed. The DCT clutches are between the electric motor and the transmission itself and are not hydraulically actuated.
If fluid condition is the primary reason for the maintenance interval then @Save85's procedure should be perfectly adequate.
The adaptation procedure is interesting, that seems like something you would need to do after replacing the clutch or actuator itself. Assuming you get all of the air out of the system the mechanical relation between the clutch fork, the slave cylinder and the resolver / actuator shouldn't change. That's one reason the just removing fluid from the reservoir and replacing it with fresh could be equally if not more effective. No need to bleed the system so no need for adaptation. Unless the adaptation is to account for clutch wear, which would be an odd thing to not have the ECU do on it's own.
I had the service done at the dealer at 22.5k and like you, spent about $140 for the pleasure. That works out to ~$.06 / mile which is more than I spend on electricity to charge my PHEV (~$.04 / mile). Going forward I'll likely just monitor it and R&R as needed. YMMV as always.
In this DIY opinion- The Service Technicians pull a vacuum on the system and get as much fluid out as possible then add the fluid. The next procedure would be for exercising the clutch to remove any entrapped air. There is no bleed port or way to physically bleed fluid from the system.
Here is the actual procedure from the manual - if you scroll down to step 2 in the clutch replacement it details what the technician detailed on your bill.
One of the supposed advantages of hydraulic clutches is that they are self adjusting.
One individual on the forum went over 150,000 miles with no fluid change or adjustment-while I am not confident doing that it does point out these clutches work very well with minimal attention
Here is the actual procedure from the manual - if you scroll down to step 2 in the clutch replacement it details what the technician detailed on your bill.
One of the supposed advantages of hydraulic clutches is that they are self adjusting.
One individual on the forum went over 150,000 miles with no fluid change or adjustment-while I am not confident doing that it does point out these clutches work very well with minimal attention
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lev kia in framingham, ma charged me $71.16 on 3/9/20 to “replace engine clutch actuator fluid”.
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Just called them, quoted me $135. I mentioned your post and they said "That's probably because he did it as part of a service package, the car was already up in the air, so it saved some money".
Quirk Braintree is the $500 guys.
My dealer charged $165 I think. I didn't have any other major services done and there was no mention of a package discount.
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well, at least $135 is comparable with what’s on this thread, certainly better than $500! lev billed the labor at $120/hr so it seems reasonable. i wouldn’t be surprised if someone noticed it was priced incorrectly and they updated their software.
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Boston vs Framingham. I can't help but wonder if these two dealers are doing the same exact procedure or if the MA on is just using a turkey baster while the other is following the list in post #102. Either way I'd be avoiding the Boston dealer like poison .
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i think the problem is that most dealers sell so few evs the service department doesn’t get a lot of experience working on them. the $500 dealer probably doesn’t even know what a clutch actuator is and just threw out a number, and since it’s a such a small percentage of his business doesn’t care if you show up. or maybe would even prefer that you don’t so he doesn’t have to figure it out......
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Yes, I've had that problem. My local Kia dealer seems to have invested in training a few of their mechanics (which is good), but some of their service writers are clueless about the Niro (which is not good). After getting an extremely uninformed and incorrect response from their service writers on two separate calls asking to sign up for service (that they thought they weren't qualified to perform, but they were), I posted a negative review on social media for their shop. That got attention from the corporate folks pretty quickly, and everything was resolved after that.
I haven't had my actuator fluid changed yet, but I'm due. I inquired about that service the last time I visited my dealer and was told that they know how to do it and it's a $115 job. Of course, I could do it for about $10 if I chose the turkey baster method, but I've got some other concerns, so I should probably visit them.
I haven't had my actuator fluid changed yet, but I'm due. I inquired about that service the last time I visited my dealer and was told that they know how to do it and it's a $115 job. Of course, I could do it for about $10 if I chose the turkey baster method, but I've got some other concerns, so I should probably visit them.
The KIA dealership said the same thing. They check it to see if it is still clean and if it still has enough. I heard someone say that they have gone up to 80,000miles until they had to change it. I think it depends where you live. If you live in a dusty area in believe you have to change it every 22k.
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I did mine today. Even though I probably have lower mileage at 18 months than GBillyG had at one month, my owner’s manual indicates that it should be done at 18 months or 22,500 miles, whichever comes first.
I thought about paying the dealer $100+, but then I also thought that my mileage is absurdly low (still under 6k), and approximately half of my miles are all electric, short drives around town, where there is no heat buildup in the ICE and very little in the transmission. Also, I live in an arid environment in Southern California which means less concern about moisture in the fluid. So I opted to DIY this time, and maybe take it to the dealer the next time. One other consideration that was running through my mind was that sometimes a mechanic tinkering on my car makes things worse and I’d rather not expose myself to that needlessly.
I wrote a note stating the date and mileage that I did this and stuck it in my file for the Niro. I stapled the brake fluid receipt to the note, so that I will have documentation if there’s ever any question.
I’m also mindful that the manual says the fluid should be replaced at 18 months, but it doesn’t say anything about the technique that must be used. I replaced the fluid, so I believe that I’m compliant. No, I didn’t get all of it out, but no one does (not even a dealer. The same is true for oil changes). I imagine the dealer’s technique might be superior if they follow the shop manual guidance (no way to be certain that they will though), but given my low mileage, I don’t think “superior” is necessarily required in my case.
One thing I would suggest for anyone else going down this path: get a big syringe instead of a “turkey baster”. You’re only transferring three or four ounces of fluid if you are only evacuating the reservoir. I have a big syringe that I got from a cooking store to inject brine into a turkey. You might want to put a short piece of tubing on the syringe. Unlike a turkey baster, you don’t usually have to worry about brake fluid dripping out of a syringe (if you’re careful) while you are transferring it from the reservoir to your waste fluid container, but a turkey baster can drip some out if you’re not careful. Since it’s corrosive and melts paint and electric wire insulation, that’s an important advantage.
Some folks have posted photos that showed light yellow fluid. Mine was amber. Not sure what explains that. Maybe they introduced air into the fluid by using a turkey baster and squeezing the bulb after it was inserted in the reservoir (this is another advantage of a syringe in that you’re less likely to make that mistake with a syringe). On the other hand, the photos I’ve seen remind me of what SAE 80 transmission oil looks like when water is mixed with it: it’s that same color. So maybe their cap was loose/leaking-air and they live in a humid environment. I’d be rather concerned if my brake/clutch fluid looked like that. I’ll post my before and after photos of the reservoir, and also a photo of the waste fluid (it’s in an old plastic mustard bottle in the photo).
I thought about paying the dealer $100+, but then I also thought that my mileage is absurdly low (still under 6k), and approximately half of my miles are all electric, short drives around town, where there is no heat buildup in the ICE and very little in the transmission. Also, I live in an arid environment in Southern California which means less concern about moisture in the fluid. So I opted to DIY this time, and maybe take it to the dealer the next time. One other consideration that was running through my mind was that sometimes a mechanic tinkering on my car makes things worse and I’d rather not expose myself to that needlessly.
I wrote a note stating the date and mileage that I did this and stuck it in my file for the Niro. I stapled the brake fluid receipt to the note, so that I will have documentation if there’s ever any question.
I’m also mindful that the manual says the fluid should be replaced at 18 months, but it doesn’t say anything about the technique that must be used. I replaced the fluid, so I believe that I’m compliant. No, I didn’t get all of it out, but no one does (not even a dealer. The same is true for oil changes). I imagine the dealer’s technique might be superior if they follow the shop manual guidance (no way to be certain that they will though), but given my low mileage, I don’t think “superior” is necessarily required in my case.
One thing I would suggest for anyone else going down this path: get a big syringe instead of a “turkey baster”. You’re only transferring three or four ounces of fluid if you are only evacuating the reservoir. I have a big syringe that I got from a cooking store to inject brine into a turkey. You might want to put a short piece of tubing on the syringe. Unlike a turkey baster, you don’t usually have to worry about brake fluid dripping out of a syringe (if you’re careful) while you are transferring it from the reservoir to your waste fluid container, but a turkey baster can drip some out if you’re not careful. Since it’s corrosive and melts paint and electric wire insulation, that’s an important advantage.
Some folks have posted photos that showed light yellow fluid. Mine was amber. Not sure what explains that. Maybe they introduced air into the fluid by using a turkey baster and squeezing the bulb after it was inserted in the reservoir (this is another advantage of a syringe in that you’re less likely to make that mistake with a syringe). On the other hand, the photos I’ve seen remind me of what SAE 80 transmission oil looks like when water is mixed with it: it’s that same color. So maybe their cap was loose/leaking-air and they live in a humid environment. I’d be rather concerned if my brake/clutch fluid looked like that. I’ll post my before and after photos of the reservoir, and also a photo of the waste fluid (it’s in an old plastic mustard bottle in the photo).
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I had that same question so I asked the person who was servicing my car at the dealership and he told me that they check the fluid to see if it dirty and/or if there is a leak. If it is clean they don’t do anything. He also said that it will not void the warranty. They will check again at the next oil change. Maybe you change at 22500k if you live in a desert. I live in the city and I am approaching 22500 and the fluid is it clean. Idk.
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That is not a statement to accept from a dealership. If you change the fluid per the maintenance schedule, and there's some sort of issue with the system during the warranty period, Kia would have an argument to deny any warranty claim. The dealership is not the one who honors the warranty, and they can make no (valid) statement the contradicts the warranty terms that apply to your car.
I am having second thoughts. I think I am change regardless if it is clean or not. I don’t want anything happening because they might lie and say that I refused. I think I am going to do to research to find a mechanic who specializes in hybrid cars. The problem is that it is hard because most don’t know how to work on hybrid cars.
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