[kaos42]

Hi all. I've only had my Niro EV 4 a few weeks now and trying to understand the climate control. The car does not have the heat pump and I noticed that if the auto climate setting is on and the temperature is set to around 22C when outside is less than 15C the aircon light comes on and via the climate control screen the heat button is not illuminated. The car does seem to blow warm (not very hot) air into the cabin. Looking at the real time energy consumption the climate control uses around 0.7KW. If the temperature is turned up higher to 25C or above, then the aircon lights goes off and the heat one comes on.

My question is - is this typical for aircon to generate heat if no heat pump is fitted?

I did call the garage for them to check the VIN and they confirmed no heat pump is installed. Just not what I was expecting.

As a tip for new owners, after a 220 mile trip where I was getting gradually colder, beware of turning off the auto button for climate. On the dash I manually turned off aircon and did not appreciate that no matter how high (27C) you turn up the desired temperature the car will not activate the HEAT (ptc?) function - this has to be done manually via the climate control screen, or auto has to be switched on when you change the temperature. Early days.

 

[kaos42]

Hi all. I've only had my Niro EV 4 a few weeks now and trying to understand the climate control. The car does not have the heat pump and I noticed that if the auto climate setting is on and the temperature is set to around 22C when outside is less than 15C the aircon light comes on and via the climate control screen the heat button is not illuminated. The car does seem to blow warm (not very hot) air into the cabin. Looking at the real time energy consumption the climate control uses around 0.7KW. If the temperature is turned up higher to 25C or above, then the aircon lights goes off and the heat one comes on.

My question is - is this typical for aircon to generate heat if no heat pump is fitted?

I did call the garage for them to check the VIN and they confirmed no heat pump is installed. Just not what I was expecting.

As a tip for new owners, after a 220 mile trip where I was getting gradually colder, beware of turning off the auto button for climate. On the dash I manually turned off aircon and did not appreciate that no matter how high (27C) you turn up the desired temperature the car will not activate the HEAT (ptc?) function - this has to be done manually via the climate control screen, or auto has to be switched on when you change the temperature. Early days.

Just to add to the above, and somewhat contradict it at the same time, I've just had to pop out in the car on a rainy 13C day here in the UK and set the temp to 21C driver only (auto level III). The fans were going slow and in the climate screen it showed the HEAT as on which makes sense, however the air was cold like it was just coming from outside and in the energy monitor screen the climate control system was using zero energy. I was out less than ten minutes and nothing seemed to improve, there is no way that the interior of the car was even close to 21C so I'm baffled as to what logic the system has. I believe if I increased the temp it would start generating heat but surely the whole point of climate control settings is to not have to keep messing about. If the PTC was 'warming up' I would have expected to see some consumption on the climate control. For the time being I am leaving the car in normal mode as opposed to eco, sport or snow.

 

[Johnxyz]

After much experimenting with our 2019 NIRO PHEV with dual automatic climate control I have come to this conclusion- Just keep it in auto and let it do its thing - we keep the temperature set at 72 degrees year around. It keeps the windows defogged etc and removes all the aggravation of trying to outthink the automatic climate control.

 

[kaos42]

After much experimenting with our 2019 NIRO PHEV with dual automatic climate control I have come to this conclusion- Just keep it in auto and let it do its thing - we keep the temperature set at 72 degrees year around. It keeps the windows defogged etc and removes all the aggravation of trying to outthink the automatic climate control.

Thanks. After having Bmw and Toyotas it is apparent that all companies have their own special little ways of implementing climate control, but for me it just seemed odd that aircon would activate for a little increase of heat (sometimes) and other times the PTC would activate, often then followed by switching back to aircon. I'd like to believe that someone somewhere has programmed this to be efficient which in real world conditions can be in contention with being effective. Early days, ultimately the auto setting will hopefully work itself out - but I would feel happier if when setting the temp to something warmer than the car is the climate system would oblige.

 

[atc98092]

If the detected humidity within the cabin is high enough, the A/C will run in tandem with the heater, as A/C is vastly more efficient in removing the moisture. It happens with other brands as well. I can feel warm air coming from my Bolt's dash vents, but the A/C light is illuminated. The Bolt isn't available with a heat pump in any model.

 

[Peter Jay]

The climate control on my '22 EV EX drives me nuts when using the defogger. The cabin temperature is rarely close to what the system is set to; I've used the term "human baked goods" on this forum more than once. And sometimes, of course, it's too cold.

BTW after months of ownership, I finally figured out how to use the HVAC fan for power ventilation. It was only intuitive to me once I'd got it figured out. You turn up the fan speed control knob, and make sure that the heat and AC buttons are not lit. Voila. Works with the recirculate function/LED either on or off, but you'll get more outside air with that LED off.

 

[Salewhite]

I have a car fitted with a heat pump and am struggling to get any heat out of it. No matter what buttons I seem to have pressed it resolutely refuses to do anything but blast out cold air. Anyone got any ideas? The manual is useless and the garage can't look at it for several weeks. My wfe thinks it's user error and I think it's just broken.

 

[Peter Jay]

@Salewhite I agree. As long as you have the temperature set to let's say, 68 degrees or above, it sounds like it's just broken to me.

 

[Peter Jay]

Update on defogger: Cabin temperature seems to be much more controllable when setting the climate to air (arrow) + defogger instead of defog-only.

Depending upon the outside temperature, using heat, even in car equipped with heat pump, a LOT of battery is consumed, can easily be as much as 33% of power consumption. On more than on occasion, I have observed the Guess-o-Meter drop one mile per 2/3 mile or so of driving, and the power consumption drop to 3.0m/kWh. And that's in 40+(F) degree outside temp.

If any of you are doing better than that, please report it here. Mine might be just running on electric heating element and could be broken too.

 

[Peter Jay]

Note to moderator: Just realized that this is in a 2023+ section. Will move my comments to another section later, or you may do so if you are able to and wish to.

 

[Tommy_D]

I just recently started using heat on my '22 Niro EV with the heat pump. I found that if I did not turn the "heat" button on, I would only get cold air. It didnt matter what temperature I set the HVAC to. So, you have to turn the heat button on. It was mid 40's this past weekend and was mid 30's this morning. I had the heater on and set the temperature to 68 degrees and had the seat heater on the lowest setting. I was comfortable in a spring/fall jacket, no gloves or hat. According to the battery usage screen, the HVAC consumed slightly less energy than the rest of the electronics on the car (~6%). I still managed 4.5 miles/kWh on my drive in to work.

Was the air hot? No, not at all. Was it cold? Not really but it also didn't really feel like it would "heat" the cabin at this setting. Just kept it from being really cold.

I'm very stingy with my heater use after driving a Chevy Volt for the last 3 years. The electric heater in that thing was so energy hungry. It would consume almost as much electricity as it took to propel the car down the road. I pretty much never turned the heat on in that car even when it was 0 degrees outside. That was pretty brutal. The Niro looks to be much more energy friendly.

 

[atc98092]

Moved to the EV section for this model year.

 

[atc98092]

I'm very stingy with my heater use after driving a Chevy Volt for the last 3 years. The electric heater in that thing was so energy hungry. It would consume almost as much electricity as it took to propel the car down the road.

Yes, the Bolt is similar. A standard electric heater takes far more power than a heat pump. The max draw I see is a bit over 7 kW, while the A/C (which uses the same level of energy as a heat pump) never goes over 2 kW. In my Bolt, I lose about 40% of my range in winter because of the heater. Unfortunately, I can't tolerate cold temps, so the heat has to be on at a comfortable level.

 

[Peter Jay]

Maybe I don't know how to use the heat pump (should work just by turning on the heat, no?) or maybe it's got an issue. I'm positive the hardware is there. Just read an article where it says the heat pump has about 10% impact at 19 degrees (F). Guess I'll have it looked at. Man, I hate going to the dealer, but there's no other choice.

 

[Tommy_D]

Maybe I don't know how to use the heat pump (should work just by turning on the heat, no?) or maybe it's got an issue. I'm positive the hardware is there. Just read an article where it says the heat pump has about 10% impact at 19 degrees (F). Guess I'll have it looked at. Man, I hate going to the dealer, but there's no other choice.

I think the car does all the heat pump/heating element switching all on its own. I can't see any way where you can choose specifically to use the heat pump and not use the other heating element. So, you just turn the heat on, set the temperature you want, and the car does the rest of the work.

 

[Peter Jay]

So as I said, what I see is the heat having a tremendous drain on the battery. I will take it in to be looked at.

 

[Tommy_D]

So as I said, what I see is the heat having a tremendous drain on the battery. I will take it in to be looked at.

How much power does the battery usage information screen say the HVAC is drawing? What is the outside temperature? Mid 40's? Has the car sat outside all night or in a garage? Are you supplementing heat by using the seat and steering wheel heater? Is the HVAC trying to dehumidify the inside air (running the A/C)?

As you know from owning an EV, there are many factors that can change the amount of power draw the car has. My car typically sits in a garage at night where it is a good 20 degrees warmer than the outside air. So the cabin of my car doesn't need much heat (power) to keep it warm. That said, I did have the car parked outside over the weekend where it was in the upper 20's all night. The car/battery was cold. My drive home from where the car was parked was on the highway at 70 mph and I did use the heat at 69 degrees with outside temperatures in the upper 30's - low 40's. I also used the seat heater at the mid setting. Was I warm? Ehh, not cozy warm, but I was comfortable to not need gloves and my feet weren't chilled. My HVAC had a draw that varied from 0.4-1.0 kWh, sometimes even turning off. I averaged 3.7 m/kWh on my 180 mile trip in these conditions.

 

[Peter Jay]

As an aside, I find the steering wheel heater makes the wheel uncomfortably warm for my taste, and the same goes for the seat heater, even on the low setting.

A steering wheel cover helped a lot, as did a seat cushion.

Meanwhile I've found the consumption when heat is on to drop as much as 0.9 m/kWh or more, and this is at over 40 degrees (F). And consumption will stay that way for many miles.

 

[atc98092]

Meanwhile I've found the consumption when heat is on to go as high as 0.9kW/m or more, even at over 40 degrees (F). And stay that way for many miles.

That doesn't seem right for long term. At least in my Bolt, the heater draws 7+ kW when it first kicks on, but once the cabin is stabilized, the power use drops to 2-3 kW to maintain temps. That usually happens within 5 minutes or so. But if your system isn't getting the cabin to the set temp, then I can see the power draw continuing for some time.

 

[kaos42]

I have a car fitted with a heat pump and am struggling to get any heat out of it. No matter what buttons I seem to have pressed it resolutely refuses to do anything but blast out cold air. Anyone got any ideas? The manual is useless and the garage can't look at it for several weeks. My wfe thinks it's user error and I think it's just broken.

Kia does seem to have an interesting take on climate control. Forget using the control panel under the screen and instead access via the infotainment. What I discovered is that the "HEAT" option can (only) be manually turned on - meaning that no matter whatever desired temp is selected it will not activate the heat function unless you are in full auto climate control. Not sure whether this is common to EVs since I'm coming from an ICE where heat is a waste function of the engine. Why there could not be a HEAT as well as an AC button on the climate / auto control panel I don't know but I discovered this after a long cold drive. My car does not have a heat pump and I started this thread since I notice that in auto climate mode sometimes my car will not have HEAT on but instead AC despite me wanting to increase the cabin temp and it does seem to blow warm air - whether this means is can do some basic scavenging even without a heat pump I don't know, but generally speaking the aircon system is more efficient than the PTC heater.

One other factor is that heat rarely comes out of the front vents, I think it is by default directed to the footwell - so sometimes selecting the front vents only will result in warm air - but again on planet climate control world the thinking is that heat should be only presented indirectly.

Finally, I think the PTC heater is relatively slow to react - so some patience is required, probably three or four minutes. It is noticeable in the energy monitor that the consumption takes sometime to ramp up at which point heat can be felt.