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framednlv... That looks good... I was worried about the "PH" being really noticeable, but I just did my first tire rotation today, and left the covers off... Not as bad as I thought...

I'll be driving 250 miles this Sunday without the covers... mostly Interstate, so it will be a true test on the mileage debate. This will be my third trip to this location, and both times previously, I got about 58 mpg... So, we'll see... ;-)

I just ordered those center caps...
 

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Unfortunately not. Too many other variables such as temperature and wind and how well a random pump filled your tank. Wind tunnel test would be required but that’s pointless to except for putting an actual number to the energy savings. My guess is around 1% or less. Good luck with the road test though. I’d never be able to parse a 1% change. That’s about ½ mpg if you can somehow hold the other variables constant.
 

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Some quick pictures, the first one shows where I had to remove some plastic to clear the axle on the front wheels.
I removed mine, the center hub opening is 3-5/8". I found all the stock Kia hub openings for most wheels are 3-5/16''. I don't know why the Niro wheels with covers are different, but they are.. I found and ordered some silver 3-5/8" dia caps, they have the five tabs about the same as inner hub opening slots, so hopefully they click in. I can see where the the front axle and bolt might interfere a little. If they fit, I might order some black KIA stick ons or stylized K that are available everywhere, which are slightly less diameter.
 

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I removed mine, the center hub opening is 3-5/8". I found all the stock Kia hub openings for most wheels are 3-5/16''. I don't know why the Niro wheels with covers are different, but they are.. I found and ordered some silver 3-5/8" dia caps, they have the five tabs about the same as inner hub opening slots, so hopefully they click in. I can see where the the front axle and bolt might interfere a little. If they fit, I might order some black KIA stick ons or stylized K that are available everywhere, which are slightly less diameter.

The size I looked up for the center bore was 67.1mm which is 2.64 inches. Which model Niro do you have?
 

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Unfortunately not. Too many other variables such as temperature and wind and how well a random pump filled your tank. Wind tunnel test would be required but that’s pointless to except for putting an actual number to the energy savings. My guess is around 1% or less. Good luck with the road test though. I’d never be able to parse a 1% change. That’s about ½ mpg if you can somehow hold the other variables constant.

I agree, too many variables. Slow down one time for another car and back up to speed, the test if over.
 

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The size I looked up for the center bore was 67.1mm which is 2.64 inches. Which model Niro do you have?
I have the LX. That's the size I measured. 2-5/8" is 2.65 inches. The FE would be the same. I believe the models with 18" wheels without wheel covers have the KIA standard 2-5/16" (~59MM).

Did you find any Kia center caps to for the larger 67mm size, or any good generic caps? There should be some available, because there are five slots inside to accept a cap. I just can't find Kia OE.
 

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Realto,
You are confusing me. First you say 3-5/8" and now 2-5/8". Then you ask if I found Kia center caps. I did not find Kia center caps. I did find 67mm center caps and posted a link on the first page of this thread. Please read the whole thread or your MPG will fall off a cliff.
 

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Realto,
You are confusing me. First you say 3-5/8" and now 2-5/8". Then you ask if I found Kia center caps. I did not find Kia center caps. I did find 67mm center caps and posted a link on the first page of this thread. Please read the whole thread or your MPG will fall off a cliff.
Sorry, I made a typo with the 3. My LX is 2-5/8", the standard Kia wheel has 2-5/16". I actually ordered the ones you linked to. I sure hope my mileage stays on the cliff. I'm already giving up 1MPG for the silver roof rails I don't use (according to EPA est., for what that's worth). Approaching 50MPG without the plastic covers would be totally unacceptable!
 

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Sorry, I made a typo with the 3. My LX is 2-5/8", the standard Kia wheel has 2-5/16". I actually ordered the ones you linked to. I sure hope my mileage stays on the cliff. I'm already giving up 1MPG for the silver roof rails I don't use (according to EPA est., for what that's worth). Approaching 50MPG without the plastic covers would be totally unacceptable!

My Niro went off the rails, roof rails that is. I ordered the moulding for the FE and cut the studs off my LX. I'm really wanted the +1MPG. Kidding, I just hate the look of roof rails, even more when they don't color match.
 

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I think the rails cost more like 2 mpg, but it does depend on your city/highway mix. But I agree, looks better without and even if not, unacceptable in an efficient car.
 

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My Niro went off the rails, roof rails that is. I ordered the moulding for the FE and cut the studs off my LX. I'm really wanted the +1MPG. Kidding, I just hate the look of roof rails, even more when they don't color match.
There was a poster I think on this forum a while back who said he removed his. In fact, once I was joking about the extremes to save more fuel and said you could drive naked for weight, remove the glove box, carpeting, rear seat, head unit, and rearview mirrors. I think it was same guy that also removed his pass. side rearview mirror and was serious! Then had a link to a hypermiler site that showed the drag created by the mirrors. Geez, you could probably take a couple less uneeded trips to the 7-11 per year and save more fuel.
 

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It was me who removed the roof rails and the unneeded by me (I never use it) passenger outside mirror. Sorry you find citing sources to back up the aero savings as ludicrous. And you are making a joke of everything here, but it happens I never make trips to convenience stores and I never make short trips by anything but bicycle. I will always have at least two tasks to combine anytime I drive my car. So yes, I save a lot of fuel. Making fun of that on a hybrid forum is in poor taste. Perhaps you meant this for a muscle car forum.

I also removed a good bit of weight from my car, but that was not the primary purpose of customizing the interior so I could easily bring my bicycle on long trips. Still have my glovebox and carpet - auto carpet is really light, so it would indeed be a joke to remove it unless you track a muscle car.

I'm very disappointed with your disrespectful post.
 

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yticolev- well, I am sorry, I didn't know it was a current member and especially not you. You do have some good posts. So nothing personal. However, I must be honest- I still think it's ridiculous removing safety items from a vehicle, even though you may think an outside pass. mirror is not. And I thought the post said they had removed carpet, so maybe it was another poster too. If I fold my seats down, I can still fit in two good sized straight handled fitness bikes, and I prefer the flat surface. I cant imagine removing the seat and have the battery box area sitting there to get banged up. But to each his own.
 

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So a new load floor (with carpet) replaced the seats. The bicycle can go in upright, allowing full space for sleeping in car on trips. Still no PT Cruiser, but it makes it better for me.

As far as the side view mirror goes, I think it is a detriment to safety and would not use it if I had left it there. If I had to rely on it to make a fast lane change, it is far slower focus on it rather than just turning your head (in heavy traffic it is risky to take your eyes off traffic in front to focus on a small far away mirror that is distorted). In addition, my inside third party mirror provides a panoramic view that is better than the side mirror. As a plus, it is delightful to have a better view through the passenger window. The only minus is very small, it is occasionally nice when parallel parking to have a passenger side mirror, and one that dips like top trims would be even better. Easy to live without, and the backup camera takes up the slack.

By the way, the regulators only require one mirror with a good view to the rear in a car. So no laws have been broken.

Finally, I don't care what others do, but increasing efficiency is just as valid a hobby than a lot of bling people like to put on or option onto cars. If everyone was willing and had the money to increase the efficiency of every car in the world by 3-5%, we would be well on our way to improving the environment, the climate, and reducing lives and treasure foolishly spent in the Middle East. Everyone with a Niro is doing their part.
 

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I would belive the difference in MPG between the FE and the LX to be more a factor of the passenger side mirror than the roof rails. I don't see how the weight of the rails will make as much of a difference compared to the weight variance of the person or people inside the car. I know i do quite a bit of driving by myself. That is why I have a car, to get around to the far off places and to bring stuff like groceries and materials for my work back to my home. I can definitely see a difference in the MPG when the family joins me compared to when I am driving by myself.



The side mirror, on the other hand, has a very large profile that sticks out into the wind stream, so it will create quite the amount of turbulence down the car. But from my side, I would rather give up that 1mpg for the safety they give in you can quickly glance to see what is around you much faster with the mirrors before you indicate and then do the far more dangerous shoulder check (as it takes far longer to turn, focus, see and then look back forward)
 

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By the way, the regulators only require one mirror with a good view to the rear in a car. So no laws have been broken.
I'm not certain that is quite accurate. Perhaps it's a state by state requirement, but at least here in WA you must have a driver's side mirror, and either a passenger side mirror OR an interior rear view mirror. Since you have the interior mirror, you are legal.

But for vehicles with either a blocked view from the inside (large packages blocking the view, or a vehicle without a back window like a large truck, then the right side mirror is mandatory. I remember my Mom's brand new 1963 Dodge Dart didn't come with a right side mirror (in fact, few cars did back then). Dad added one. He was a long haul bus driver and felt the mirror was necessary and worthwhile. I too drove transit bus for a little while, and know how important it is to see the far side of the vehicle you're driving. I wouldn't want to drive without one myself.
 

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I would belive the difference in MPG between the FE and the LX to be more a factor of the passenger side mirror than the roof rails. I don't see how the weight of the rails will make as much of a difference
Both the FE and LX come with passenger side mirrors. The primary mpg difference between the two are the roof rails. They are quite light so you are right, it is not the weight difference, it is the aero advantage. They add more frontal area than it appears as they curve from front to back.
 

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I remember my Mom's brand new 1963 Dodge Dart didn't come with a right side mirror (in fact, few cars did back then).
I'm not quite sure when they started adding them routinely. I don't remember my 1977 Datsun B210 having them. But the cars that did have them had plain glass, not the curved glass that all vehicles seem to have now. That made it easier to take a quick glance at the mirror, but of course the downside is a bigger blind spot. When I started to drive in the US, the speed limit was 55, but I never drove that slow. Which turns out to be good training to always be aware of what is behind you! That habit of glancing at the rear mirror every few seconds (even though I now drive mostly at the speed limit) means I'm always aware of the vehicles around me and am never surprised by someone in my "blind spot".

I still do a routine visual check, but I certainly don't take the 3 seconds it might take to focus on the small passenger side mirror and figure out the true distance of cars in the adjacent lane, and figure out if they are accelerating or not (really hard to judge in small curved mirrors). If you do everything deliberately and are not driving fast, they will work fine much of the time. The problem with putting your turn signals on and taking five seconds to confirm your space before changing lanes, these days our fellow motorists will commonly speed up so you can't!
 
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